Dwarf Fortress Bug Tracker - Dwarf Fortress
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0000231Dwarf FortressDwarf Mode -- Buildings, Generalpublic2010-04-02 20:462012-11-27 18:18
Toady One 
0000231: Body parts from large creatures (bones, meat, leather, tusks, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
When slaughtering something large, like an elephant, you get a huge stack of bones - I get around 60 per elephant.

When a bone carver then tries to do something with this big stack, he will bring the whole stack to the workshop. This is enough to instantly make the workshop heavily cluttered.

This, combined with the new behaviour where one job only processes 1 bone, not the whole stack, means that making anything from a large creature's bones is very very slow compared to the equivalent if you used bones from smaller creatures.
Edit: As noted in 0001603, the behaviour is also experienced for elephant meat and fat.
bones, workshop
related to 0000808resolved Toady One Processing Raw Turtles only makes one shell per stack, and other stack size issues 
has duplicate 0001238resolved Footkerchief Labors taking too long / auto-clutter 
has duplicate 0001489resolved Logical2u Super clutter with one elephant tusk 
has duplicate 0001603closed Logical2u giant stacks of elephant bones/fat instantly clutter kitchens or workshops, making work extremely slow. 
has duplicate 0004202resolved Logical2u Large stacks of bones cause ungodly clutter in workshops 
has duplicate 0004341resolved Footkerchief Some animal byproducts overclutter anything they placed in. 
has duplicate 0004418resolved Footkerchief Clutter from wool, sheared from one animal 
has duplicate 0004465resolved Footkerchief Single hides clutter tanners shop causing slow reactions 
has duplicate 0004800resolved Knight Otu One yak skull (perhaps others) clutters crafter's shop to *CLT* 
Issue History
2010-04-02 20:46oliverNew Issue
2010-04-02 21:06YmrelNote Added: 0000412
2010-04-02 21:28oliverNote Added: 0000420
2010-04-02 21:39clamityTag Attached: bones
2010-04-02 21:39clamityTag Attached: workshop
2010-04-02 23:16DoctorZuberNote Added: 0000436
2010-04-03 00:15AmpersandNote Added: 0000445
2010-04-03 16:12GauHelldragonNote Added: 0000703
2010-04-09 03:42Khym ChanurIssue Monitored: Khym Chanur
2010-04-16 10:09FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001238
2010-04-19 15:34Von KriegerNote Added: 0004272
2010-04-24 11:03FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001489
2010-04-28 04:39Logical2uRelationship addedhas duplicate 0001603
2010-04-28 04:43Logical2uSummaryBone stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down => Bone, food stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down
2010-04-28 04:43Logical2uDescription Updatedbug_revision_view_page.php?rev_id=2003#r2003
2010-04-28 04:44Logical2uSummaryBone, food stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down => Bone, food stacks from large creatures slows workshops down due to clutter
2010-04-28 06:22random51Note Added: 0005514
2010-04-28 13:58FootkerchiefCategoryGeneral => Dwarf Mode -- Buildings, General
2010-06-22 09:05FootkerchiefRelationship replacedhas duplicate 0001238
2010-06-22 09:05FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000808
2010-08-03 08:50greycatNote Added: 0011442
2011-03-12 09:39Logical2uRelationship addedhas duplicate 0004202
2011-03-12 11:49SeraphIssue Monitored: Seraph
2011-03-25 13:26FootkerchiefRelationship addedhas duplicate 0004341
2011-03-26 05:39RedKingNote Added: 0016632
2011-03-28 01:07BlahNote Added: 0016707
2011-03-28 01:11BlahNote Edited: 0016707bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016707#r6223
2011-03-28 01:11BlahNote Edited: 0016707bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016707#r6224
2011-03-28 06:45XelantholNote Added: 0016716
2011-04-01 12:40FootkerchiefRelationship addedhas duplicate 0004418
2011-04-01 20:11nb4estIssue Monitored: nb4est
2011-04-02 14:47RhenayaNote Added: 0016992
2011-04-02 14:47RhenayaIssue Monitored: Rhenaya
2011-04-07 11:30Logical2uRelationship addedparent of 0004465
2011-04-07 11:37FootkerchiefSummaryBone, food stacks from large creatures slows workshops down due to clutter => Stacks of body parts from large creatures (bone, meat, leather, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
2011-04-07 11:38FootkerchiefRelationship replacedhas duplicate 0004465
2011-04-07 12:09Logical2uRelationship replacedhas duplicate 0001489
2011-04-07 12:09Logical2uIssue Monitored: monk12
2011-04-07 12:09Logical2uIssue Monitored: RossM
2011-04-07 12:09Logical2uSummaryStacks of body parts from large creatures (bone, meat, leather, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter => Body parts from large creatures (bones, meat, leather, tusks, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
2011-04-07 14:18DawideIssue Monitored: Dawide
2011-04-07 22:11wRARIssue Monitored: wRAR
2011-04-09 10:04kwielandNote Added: 0017241
2011-04-17 00:58ImmacolataIssue Monitored: Immacolata
2011-04-17 00:58ImmacolataNote Added: 0017410
2011-04-17 01:00ImmacolataNote Edited: 0017410bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0017410#r6473
2011-04-17 09:01Hieronymous AlloyIssue Monitored: Hieronymous Alloy
2011-04-27 00:11ImmacolataNote Edited: 0017410bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0017410#r6526
2011-05-14 20:17RatalonNote Added: 0017729
2011-06-27 14:34afftorNote Added: 0018056
2011-08-03 08:24Knight OtuRelationship addedhas duplicate 0004800
2012-02-17 11:47foxbyteNote Added: 0019949
2012-02-17 12:13FootkerchiefSticky IssueNo => Yes
2012-02-21 10:02janglurNote Added: 0020390
2012-02-22 12:50kingpeonidasNote Added: 0020478
2012-02-22 12:50kingpeonidasIssue Monitored: kingpeonidas
2012-02-22 12:53kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7614
2012-02-22 12:56kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7615
2012-02-22 13:00kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7616
2012-02-22 13:00kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7617
2012-02-22 13:01kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7618
2012-02-22 13:01kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7619
2012-02-22 13:05kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7620
2012-02-22 13:08kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020478bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020478#r7621
2012-02-23 11:45QmarxNote Added: 0020561
2012-02-24 12:58afftorNote Added: 0020618
2012-02-26 11:48BuglistIssue Monitored: Buglist
2012-02-27 15:05kingpeonidasNote Added: 0020803
2012-02-27 15:07kingpeonidasNote Edited: 0020803bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020803#r7743
2012-02-27 23:52etherflanNote Added: 0020828
2012-02-27 23:54etherflanNote Edited: 0020828bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020828#r7748
2012-02-27 23:56etherflanNote Edited: 0020828bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0020828#r7749
2012-02-28 06:28FootkerchiefNote Added: 0020835
2012-03-14 03:58Toady OneStatusnew => resolved
2012-03-14 03:58Toady OneFixed in Version => Next Version
2012-03-14 03:58Toady OneResolutionopen => fixed
2012-03-14 03:58Toady OneAssigned To => Toady One
2012-03-15 13:02FootkerchiefSticky IssueYes => No
2012-03-15 15:35BuglistIssue End Monitor: Buglist
2012-03-27 09:24RhenayaIssue End Monitor: Rhenaya
2012-04-22 09:02SeraphIssue End Monitor: Seraph
2012-11-27 18:18nb4estIssue End Monitor: nb4est

2010-04-02 21:06   
Not sure if this qualifies as a bug. From a realism standpoint, it should take longer to carve many bones as compared to a few bones. Taking the entire stack at once might be a problem, but I'm not sure if it's a "bug".
2010-04-02 21:28   
The problem is that it's not taking a long time to carve a big stack; it's taking a long time to carve a single bone from a big stack. Each job only processes 1 bone, and is much slower than an equivalent job processing 1 bone from a smaller stack.
2010-04-02 23:16   
60 bones
Worker hauls all 60 bones
crafting shop becomes instantly cluttered

so crafting arrows, trade goods, whatever, is therefore done at a highly reduced rate simply because of the quirk of haulers bringing a full stack at once on you.

While I agree this sounds annoying, I would not classify this as a major issue.
2010-04-03 00:15   
Bone stacks probably ought to be divided into easier to digest stacks. This probably is a bug, just from noting a lot of the other hauling related bugs, so I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it.
2010-04-03 16:12   
I've had the same clutter problem with even a single skull or tusk of an elephant. The butchery shop remains ultra cluttered with 1 item of elephant cartillage.

Speaking of elephant bone bolts... the huge stacks that clutter up the workshop only seem to result in 5 bone bolts :P
Von Krieger   
2010-04-19 15:34   
Yeah, elephant tusks, skulls, heck even an elephant eyeball will clutter up a workshop.
2010-04-28 06:22   
You think elephants are bad, try this with a jabberer.

Any jabberer item puts a workshop at max clutter.
2010-08-03 08:50   
A Draltha tooth or skull also clutters the workshop, all by itself. Not max clutter, but red. Even though the tooth is listed as weighing "<1Gamma".

Apparently there's some sort of flag attached to these items, independent of their weight, which makes them act unreasonably when they're in workshops.
2011-03-26 05:39   
I can confirm that this behavior occurs with dralthas and yaks. One yak cow skull has my craftsdwarf shop at max clutter.
2011-03-28 01:07   
(edited on: 2011-03-28 01:11)
Also occurs with a Stray Yak Calf Skin. A single one is enough to (CLT) my Tanner's Workshop.

Doesn't occur with Stray Alpaca Skin, Stray Goat Skin.

2011-03-28 06:45   
Yeah this is frustrating-I would appreciate a look at this in the next bug fix. :3
2011-04-02 14:47   
i noticed that yak stuff is in general prone to clutter everything

i am currently making bone bolts on several workshops, they are all kept tidy so only the work material is in them and still i get something like that:

yak bull bone (3) -> *clt*
giant badger bone (14) -> (clt)
stray horse foal bone (13) -> (clt)

so 3 yak bull bones seem to clutter a workshop more than 5 times giant badger ones
2011-04-09 10:04   
A single buffalo hair, 8 weight, causes extreme clutter in a farmer's workshop.
2011-04-17 00:58   
(edited on: 2011-04-27 00:11)
Stray horse bones do the same in 31.25 - bones from one Stray horse (8 it seems) in my Craftdwarfs workshop causes purple *CLT*. http://postimage.org/image/1hswu68x0/ [^]

2011-05-14 20:17   
31.25 - The single Stray Yak Skull being made into a totem = purple clutter.
2011-06-27 14:34   
This bug makes all butcher related skills (bonecarve, tanning, cooking etc) quite annoying to use. I hope at least this gonna be fixed some day.
2012-02-17 11:47   
As of 34.01 this bug is still present.
2012-02-21 10:02   
Still present and rather disruptive
2012-02-22 12:50   
(edited on: 2012-02-22 13:08)
This could be easily fixed by having clutter calculations ignore one item (or stack), of which being any largest item in the shop at a given time. One big thing doesnt cause clutter, its just there, the other things are what keep you from working with the one large item (or stack), they are the clutter. It would be understandable that byproducts could be a clutter causing thing although unrepresented in item or inventory in the game, so some additional calculation although less severe could be added only encompassing the size of the largest item (or stack), for instance clutter for item 1 being (c = sqrt(s)*m) (clutter = squareroot of size multiplied by a coefficient (m)). this would allow the largest item (or stack) to only have a clutter effect much less severe while still paving the road for some penalty for manufacturing using T-Rex bones.

The final equation for clutter would end up being (c = (sqrt(s1)*m) + s2*m)
clutter = root of largest item (or stack) times coefficient added to the result of size of all other items multiplied by coefficient.

Or a more computationally friendly equation would instead of using a square root which would prevent issues with unforseen updates with incredibly large boned creature, would be to simply divide by a factor the first size. I perceive this method although less computationally intensive is merely a band-aid solution instead of the one change fix all method above in the sqrt equation.
EX. (c = s1*m/4) + s2*m)

LEGEND c=clutter, s1= size of largest item/stack, s2= size of all items stored not including s1, m= coefficient for clutter calculation.

Alternatively this could be introduced not in the clutter calculation at all, but instead in the workshop's inventory by detecting the largest item in the inventory each time the contents change and spoofing a rooted value of the size to be reported to the inventory itself temporarily until that item is removed which the liberty would then be passed upon the next smallest item, or another larger one is introduced removing liberty and passing it up to the new candidate for rooted size reporting. The addition of a boolean value to the objects tracked could keep record of the item with a spoofed size to indicate necessity to be squared before it is removed from the workshops inventory, and be squared when viewed as a single item through description.

2012-02-23 11:45   
Yeah, two panda skulls puts my butcher shop in the red. How clutter looks at sizes needs to be reworked.
2012-02-24 12:58   
I like how this issue is not even acknowledged yet.
2012-02-27 15:05   
(edited on: 2012-02-27 15:07)
agreed afftor.

mabye there should be a workshop resize option so you can make a 4x7 bone carver if you deployed in a elephant rich area.

2012-02-27 23:52   
(edited on: 2012-02-27 23:56)
I think this bugtracker needs a duplicate mark because "resolved" is kind of confusing to navigate.
If you look at the actual report you see that resolution = duplicate. Oh well.
From what I understand this is now the main bug report?

2012-02-28 06:28   
Use the "Manage Columns" page to make the resolution show up on the bug list page: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/account_manage_columns_page.php [^]