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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0007905Dwarf FortressDwarf Mode -- Idle Behaviorpublic2014-08-08 07:182014-08-24 17:33
ReporterDame de la Licorne 
Assigned ToToady One 
PlatformHP LaptopOSWIndowsOS Version7
Product Version0.40.06 
Target VersionFixed in Version0.40.09 
Summary0007905: Romance and marriage are mutually exclusive
DescriptionAs it says, none of my immigrated single dwarves have formed any romantic relationships in the 6+ forts that I've run for more than a year (the longest was about 5 years). They make friends, but the only married dwarves immigrated married. I have a 1x1 active meeting zone, my single dwarves have had no jobs or military assignments since the first migrant wave. No lovers/new marriages.

I do run a few mods (mostly creatures and extra reactions), the only one of which seems like it might affect this being the following:
1) added [ORIENTATION:MALE:0:0:100] and [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:100:0:0] to the female dwarf caste
2) added [ORIENTATION:MALE:100:0:0] and [ORIENTATION:FEMALE:0:0:100] to the male dwarf caste
to make my dwarves act heterosexually, according to the DF wiki.
Steps To Reproduce1) Roll initial founding wave until you have three age-appropriate pairings.
2) Embark.
3) With each migrant wave, note single dwarves and remove all jobs (including hauling). -> Only married/widowed dwarves should be working
4) Play for 1-5+ years.
5) Note no new relationships have formed (particularly obvious with the founders by the end of the first spring).
Additional InformationOther than the additional [ORIENTATION] tags, I've been setting up my forts in 0.40.xx the same way I did for DF2012 (0.34.xx) , in which I always managed to marry off the vast majority of my dwarves. But now, I have 0 committed relationships, so I'm pretty sure something might have gotten unintentionally messed up along the way.

I can post a save if necessary, but am currently on vacation and won't have access to my DF computer for about 10 days.
Tagsbinary patch, Relationships
Attached Files

- Relationships
related to 0007651resolvedToady One Default ORIENTATION excludes some animals from breeding 
related to 0008528resolvedLoci Dwarves won't talk to lovers 

-  Notes
Dame de la Licorne (reporter)
2014-08-08 07:29
edited on: 2014-08-08 07:30

It messed up in the description, it should say that the longest fort lasted about 5 years. And in "additional information", it should say about 10 days.

Quietust (reporter)
2014-08-08 08:17

Cannot reproduce - embarked with totally vanilla raws, used DFHack to force a large number of migrant waves (to quickly get my population up to 77), then stuffed everybody into a 3x3 meeting area. Within a few months, five romantic relationships started - four male/female, and one female/female.

With your custom raws, however, the same experiment produced exactly zero romantic relationships.

It's possible that the information on the wiki regarding the ORIENTATION token is wrong and that your raw modifications are explicitly forbidding romances from starting.
Borschwanger (reporter)
2014-08-08 08:29

'Two dwarves can get married after having a romantic relationship together.'

Maybe since your dwarves are never taking lovers they are never getting married?

I have tried messing with the tag a few times for world gen population reductions but never managed to figure it out. Didn't spend much time on it, though. Never went into a fort with those worlds either.
Dame de la Licorne (reporter)
2014-08-08 08:50

Alright, so this IS something that I did. I'll try messing with the tags to figure out what works. Moderators can close this, since it's not a vanilla issue.
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-08-08 08:56
edited on: 2014-08-08 08:58

It seems possible that there's a bug here. I wonder if it doesn't like the zeroes for some reason. Maybe 1:1:100000 would be different?

The wiki seems to accurately reflect Toady's post about ORIENTATION: [^]
It's a by-caste tag, so you'd use it twice for each caste if you want to set all the numbers. <male/female>:<disinterested chance>:<lover-possible chance>:<commitment-possible chance> It uses the chances to put an individual critter into any of the 9 possible configurations. Defaults are, if I remember, 75:20:5 for the same gender, and 5:20:75 for the opposite. That leads to a 3x3 grid, with numbers in it. I'm not invested in the current ones if there are better ideas, but it's probably not all that easy to make a good selection when the categorization is ad hoc anyway. I would have used caste instead of gender to allow more interesting outcomes for many-casted critters, but the optimizations would be a nightmare (already had to jump from 2 to 6 relationship pools...). Of course, all relationships are still eternal, so the lover thing is kind of broken now (sometimes it won't advance beyond lover because one of the parties is not interested in committing, but still neither ever breaks it off, ever... not unrealistic in individual cases, but strange overall). [^]
MALE/FEMALE:disinterested chance:lover-possible chance:commitment-possible chance

Dame de la Licorne (reporter)
2014-08-09 02:52

I'll do some tests once I get back to my DF computer, if no one has added any info in the meantime.
Dame de la Licorne (reporter)
2014-08-13 05:58
edited on: 2014-08-13 05:58

From what is being discussed in this thread:, [^] this bug may be related to 0007651, at least in that the animal breeding issues MIGHT be linked to unintentional ORIENTATION tags on the animals.

Quietust (reporter)
2014-08-13 06:40

I've just looked into the logic for determining whether or not two historical figures can enter a romantic relationship, and from what I can tell it looks to be broken - in order for two dwarves to enter a romantic relationship, it looks like they both need to be in the "lover possible but no commitment possible" category.

Overall findings:
1. Both historical figures and unit souls contain a list of orientation flags:
* [unknown]
* can start romance with male
* can marry male
* can start romance with female
* can marry female

2. A random number is picked between 1 and the sum of the ORIENTATION values for that caste in order to set the above flags, and the "can start romance" and "can marry" values for each gender are mutually exclusive (i.e. it will only set one or neither, never both)

3. In order to start a romance, both units must have the "can start romance" flag appropriate to their gender. Similarly, in order to marry, both units must have the "can marry" flag appropriate to their gender.

The following untested binary patch may resolve this issue in version 0.40.08 Win32 SDL by allowing historical figures with "can marry" to start romances:
08B6761 : 08 -> 18
08B676A : 02 -> 06
08B678D : 02 -> 06

Optionally, the following patch will cause the "can start romance" flag to be set along with "can marry" for newly created units and historical figures (so a new world will need to be generated), in case the above fix is insufficient:
00FE4AE : 04 -> 06
00FE4E3 : 10 -> 18
Dame de la Licorne (reporter)
2014-08-13 08:27

Interesting. I have temporary access to a more powerful computer, so I'm going to try some preliminary tests to see if I can confirm this in gameplay.

- Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
2014-08-08 07:18 Dame de la Licorne New Issue
2014-08-08 07:29 Dame de la Licorne Note Added: 0028577
2014-08-08 07:30 Dame de la Licorne Note Edited: 0028577 View Revisions
2014-08-08 07:30 Dame de la Licorne Note Edited: 0028577 View Revisions
2014-08-08 07:30 Dame de la Licorne Note Edited: 0028577 View Revisions
2014-08-08 07:30 Dame de la Licorne Note Edited: 0028577 View Revisions
2014-08-08 07:31 Dame de la Licorne Tag Attached: Relationships
2014-08-08 08:17 Quietust Note Added: 0028578
2014-08-08 08:29 Borschwanger Note Added: 0028579
2014-08-08 08:49 Footkerchief Description Updated View Revisions
2014-08-08 08:49 Footkerchief Additional Information Updated View Revisions
2014-08-08 08:50 Dame de la Licorne Note Added: 0028580
2014-08-08 08:56 Footkerchief Note Added: 0028581
2014-08-08 08:57 Footkerchief Note Edited: 0028581 View Revisions
2014-08-08 08:57 Footkerchief Note Edited: 0028581 View Revisions
2014-08-08 08:58 Footkerchief Note Edited: 0028581 View Revisions
2014-08-08 08:58 Footkerchief Assigned To => Footkerchief
2014-08-08 08:58 Footkerchief Status new => needs feedback
2014-08-09 02:52 Dame de la Licorne Note Added: 0028638
2014-08-09 02:52 Dame de la Licorne Status needs feedback => assigned
2014-08-13 05:58 Dame de la Licorne Note Added: 0028937
2014-08-13 05:58 Dame de la Licorne Note Edited: 0028937 View Revisions
2014-08-13 06:40 Quietust Note Added: 0028938
2014-08-13 06:41 Quietust Tag Attached: binary patch
2014-08-13 08:27 Dame de la Licorne Note Added: 0028942
2014-08-13 08:35 Footkerchief Summary Dwarves are not forming romantic relationships => Romance and marriage are mutually exclusive
2014-08-13 08:35 Footkerchief Status assigned => confirmed
2014-08-13 08:59 Footkerchief Relationship added related to 0007651
2014-08-13 10:18 Toady One Status confirmed => resolved
2014-08-13 10:18 Toady One Fixed in Version => Next Version
2014-08-13 10:18 Toady One Resolution open => fixed
2014-08-13 10:18 Toady One Assigned To Footkerchief => Toady One
2014-08-16 17:56 Button Issue Monitored: Button
2014-08-24 17:33 Button Issue End Monitor: Button
2014-11-08 11:05 Footkerchief Relationship added related to 0008528

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