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0003461Dwarf FortressCivilizations/Entities -- Generalpublic2010-10-23 13:572021-08-30 13:21
Quietust 
Footkerchief 
normalminorhave not tried
acknowledgedopen 
0.31.16 
 
0003461: Underground animal people don't arrive from off-map to invade your fortress
Bug 0003337 implies that underground animal-man civilizations are meant to attack your fortress once you discover/disturb them; however, in running 2 different fortress for over 15 years each, I have yet to observe this happen.

My first fortress had both antmen (which died of old age soon after I opened the caverns - by the time I got around to exploring, they were already dead) and cave fish men (whose blowguns were utterly ineffective against my military), and my second fortress also had antmen (which ended up getting killed by a forgotten beast). Neither fortress ever saw another antman or cave fish man beyond the initial settlement.
No tags attached.
related to 0003337resolved Toady One Goblins don't show up 
Issue History
2010-10-23 13:57QuietustNew Issue
2010-10-23 16:00Logical2uRelationship addedchild of 0000972
2010-10-23 19:09QuietustNote Added: 0013485
2010-10-23 21:18Logical2uNote Added: 0013486
2010-10-23 21:18Logical2uNote Edited: 0013486bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0013486#r5221
2010-10-23 21:49QuietustNote Added: 0013487
2010-10-23 22:24Logical2uNote Added: 0013488
2010-11-16 13:42FootkerchiefCategoryCivilizations/Entities => Civilizations/Entities -- General
2011-04-01 13:37FootkerchiefNote Added: 0016959
2011-04-01 13:37FootkerchiefSummaryUnderground civs don't replenish in Fortress mode => Underground civs don't arrive from off-map to invade your fortress
2011-04-01 13:39FootkerchiefRelationship deletedchild of 0000972
2011-04-01 13:41FootkerchiefNote Edited: 0016959bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016959#r6304
2011-04-01 13:42FootkerchiefNote Edited: 0016959bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016959#r6305
2011-04-01 13:43FootkerchiefNote Edited: 0016959bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016959#r6306
2011-04-01 13:44FootkerchiefNote Edited: 0016959bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0016959#r6307
2011-04-01 13:44FootkerchiefSummaryUnderground civs don't arrive from off-map to invade your fortress => Underground animal people don't arrive from off-map to invade your fortress
2013-04-13 10:21QuietustNote Added: 0023942
2014-01-29 10:37FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0003337
2014-01-29 10:39FootkerchiefAssigned To => Footkerchief
2014-01-29 10:39FootkerchiefStatusnew => acknowledged
2021-08-30 13:21QuietustNote Added: 0041142

Notes
(0013485)
Quietust   
2010-10-23 19:09   
Er, not sure what this has to do with 0000972...
(0013486)
Logical2u   
2010-10-23 21:18   
Funny how I guessed you'd say that.

Technically it's a child of 440, but they are slightly different behaviours so rather than being a dupe it's just "related", so it's better to branch them off the same parent.

There's no appropriate advancement of 'time' for anyone other than people you control (Dwarves in dwarf mode, adventurers in adventuring mode).

This causes the following

1. Historical figures (kings, liasons, people in villages, and in your case animalperson tribes) die of old age when you find them.
2. Historical figures don't properly repopulate when you're playing. This means that you don't get a new king or liason, villages can empty out entirely, and in your case animalpersons on your map die out entirely.

Also, I should note that animalperson civs are currently local only. That is, there will not be a seige of animalpeople in the current release. Essentially you killed them all, there will never be any more.

(In fact, I doubt this is really a bug, more of a misinterpretation, of animalperson behaviour)

(0013487)
Quietust   
2010-10-23 21:49   
The dev log entry back from January 9th mentions "underground invasions", and Toady's comment in the fix for 0003337 suggested that "irritating their cave feature" is supposed to trigger invasions.
(0013488)
Logical2u   
2010-10-23 22:24   
I'm pretty sure that comment on "irritating their cave feature" is more along the line of "your fortress will not be invaded by lizardmen just because you built on their city. You have to find their city first.".
(0016959)
Footkerchief   
2011-04-01 13:37   
(edited on: 2011-04-01 13:44)
I have to disagree with the relationship to 0000972 and 0000440. Off-map arrivals and repopulation of world gen populations are almost completely separate issues, there's nothing to suggest that this is linked to depletion of a map feature's abstract population, and invasions by underground animal people are definitely supposed to be a working feature.

On topic: this report could use further corroboration. Has anyone ever seen underground animal people invade from off-map in 31.x?

(0023942)
Quietust   
2013-04-13 10:21   
I just remembered some research I had done a while ago, and its results may explain the problem here:

Dwarf Fortress uses a system of timed events to handle special things arriving at your fortress from outside - Caravans, Migrants, Diplomats, Sieges, [unused], Megabeasts, Curious wildlife (e.g. rhesus macaques), Mischievous wildlife (i.e. gremlins), Flying wildlife (?), and Night creatures. The "unused" entry (ID=4) currently has no code associated with it, but in version 0.28.181.40d this event ID was used for Feature attacks (which is what caused the "rampaging tame feature creatures" bug); it's possible that the game is still creating events of this type, but the code for dispatching them is just doing nothing.
(0041142)
Quietust   
2021-08-30 13:21   
Possibly of note, I just discovered that version 0.28.181.40d contained logic for "irritating" map features when you dumped garbage into them, in exactly the same way that dumping garbage back in the 2D versions would trigger attacks from the Chasm. That "irritate" logic still exists in version 0.47.05, but it's not clear whether any logic still exists for acting on that irritation.